Just some pictures and a big thank you to everyone

[Zeb]

Debbie,

Multi seed old bread soaker rye bread based on Jeffrey Hamelman’s linseed and rye bread in 'Bread A Baker’s book of Techniques and Recipes' which is the second bread book everyone should buy after the Hand Made Loaf, and thanks to Jeremy’s post on Stir the Pots, old bread into new, who put the old bread into this.

Ingredients - this is what was in the last one I made, but you can use what you like

Soaker:

50g Old rye bread
25 g linseed
25g millet
20 g malted rye grains (sitting in the cupboard, why did I buy these?)
165g water

Starter
30g mature rye leaven
200g water
225 g dark rye flour


Make both the above at the same time, 12 hours plus before you want to mix the dough, depends how active your starter is and how sour you like your ryebread on when your starter is ready.

For the dough

All of the above. I put the soaker and the starter into a mixing bowl and mixed with a electric hand mixer on a slow speed just to make sure the old bread now squishy, got broken up and mixed in.


Then added by hand,

370 g strong white flour
105 g water
15 - 20 g salt (whatever you normally do, or maybe slightly less as the old bread has salt in it.)
about 150g worth of toasted pumpkin and sunflower seeds, sesame whatever you like,
1/4 teaspoon of easy bake yeast (I am sure you can leave this out if you want to be pure sourdough)

Makes a quite sticky dough but not a runny dough. Leave for 10 to 20 minutes and then knead it once. It’s not particularly high in water, I don’t know how to work out the hydration, it might rise a bit more if you use a higher hydration?

If you have the yeast you can do bulk ferment for about an hour and then scale and shape and then the second ferment for an hour, but I did both for double this the second time, because I kept forgetting it and it seemed fine too.

Scale and shape. I put seeds in the bottom of the banneton but you could also roll the dough in seeds too if you want them on the top. One long slash down the long axis of the bread.

Oven temp 230 degrees C for 10 minutes with steam in the oven (little tray in bottom with boiling water in) turned down to 220 once the loaf has sprung and started to go brown for 20 minutes and then 210 for the last 15/20 minutes. Basically start hot and turn it down as you go. Leave to cool and it eats best the following day.

[Susan]

Zeb, your loaf looks really beautiful!

[aulda]

Are you 'allowed' to use old bread in new bread in commercial baking?

Not sure about this question. I know you can use old bread and cake in cakes but not sure about in bread. Can't see why not.

Did you find a good 100 percent rye to use in the end?

Still looking. I want to find one with pumpkin seeds in it too as I have just bought a big sack of them!

As for slashing round loaves, we do several different designs. We do a simple cross which opens up nicely and gives a high round loaf. We then do a fairly tight hash # and sometimes a wider square. With a square we do corners intersecting on some and not on others. One that works well for our walnut and Raisin sourdough is a large cut down the middle then one smaller parallel cut on either side. This makes the loaf open up well in the middle but evenly on both sides. The loaf finishes up more oval than round. We also do a version of this where the two cuts on either side are at angles - a bit like a cnd symbol.

Finally, we do radiating' non-intersecting slashes, straight and curved but on our larger round loaves only.

We have played around quite a lot and I am sure our approach breaks the odd convention but the bread looks pretty!

Andy

[Zeb]

Aulda they sound lovely, are you going to post some pictures here? Hint hint... I think before cooking pictures are really useful, because you can't really work out what to do from the finished loaf.
the one of mine you like was just a random result you know, I was just experimenting. Straight slashes across the dough and a long slash down the middle which opened up whereas the ones across the dough didn't open at all, I think it looks a bit like a railway track. What I find interesting is that when you come to slash the dough, as a home baker you usually only have a couple to have a go on, and the image in my mind is usually of the finished product and that's what my hand wants to do, so I find I always want to make the slashes too diagonal and have only recently began to make the angle more shallow. I read on the sourdough companion site that it is a good idea to practise with a pencil on paper first, and get a 'feel' for how you want your slashes to go. Might try that next.

Here is the 100% rye that I make for non wheat eating friend. Makes 4 small loaves (400/450g size) 1100g mature rye starter 60 percent water 40 per cent rye so 200 g old starter, 360 rye and 540 water. After 12 hours (I had this wrong, the 24 hours is if your starter has been in the fridge a while and needs two refreshes - thanks Jacqueline!) : add 180 g water, 30g black molasses, 20 g salt, 460g rye flour. Any optional flavourings you want, like coriander, orange zest. Leave to double for 3 hours? you don't knead it, well you can if you want but I don't see the point really. Then spoon it into oiled and floured tins, smooth over with a bit of water to get it flat, put seeds on top if you want. My friend likes hers covered with crushed coriander seeds. I have also put a good dredging of flour on and then you get those nice irregular ravines appearing, (also helps to tell you that the bread has risen) Leave to rise again by at least a 1/3 preferably double though, then bake at 200 c or maybe 210 c for about 45 minutes to an hour. Don't know if it would work for you? You need to oil and flour the tins very well or it will stick. PS . If you are making this somewhere hot then all the times are shorter I guess, my ambient room temperature is between 19 - 21 degrees currently.

[Zeb]

sorry too much salt, should be 20 g or so, can't edit the above. the edit button disappeared.

[Debbie]

Many thanks for that recipe, Jo. I'm planning on trying it this weekend. I'll let you know how it goes.

[Debbie]

This bread is fantastic, and is definitely the nicest seeded bread I've baked.

I adapted the recipe slightly, to suit ingredients, no yeast etc.



Many thanks for posting it.

[Zeb]

Looks lovely Debbie!

Yes, you don't need the yeast as your starter will raise the bread on its own, I think you get a milder tasting loaf with the yeast spike as the bread rises a bit quicker and I think a little softer in the crumb. A lot of the breads in Jeffrey Hamelman's books have a little yeast in. I have tried both ways and I like both. (She said, sitting on the fence)

[Zeb]

Jacqueline pm'd me to say that 24 hours seems a long time for the 100 rye leaven first part and I think she is right, it only really needs that length of time if either the rye leaven has been in the fridge a while or it is quite cold, probably 8 - 14 hours is a better guide. I also didn't mention where this recipe comes from which I should do, it is based on one from the Wild Yeast Bakery course. Sorry Simon, should have credited you in the earlier post. Jo

[aulda]

Here is the 100% rye that I make for non wheat eating friend.

Jo,

Tried your recipe this morning - to great effect! Thank you. Here are some piccies...

This was what the mix looked like:



Probably a little less moist than the absolute recipe as our rye leaven is 50:50 flour water.
Here's how they baked - 500 grammes in the small tin and 800 grammes in the large tin. We think we will go for 900 grammes when we go into production.



This is the smaller loaf - more pumpkin seed needed on the outside.




Finally, this is how the crumb looks. Moist, chewy, complex flavour with some sour and lots of orange! Will probably cut the zest slightly and also try it without. Though I do like the orange flavour with the rye.




Andy